Gut Health and Anxiety | Podcast #227

Gut Health and Anxiety | Podcast #227


Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hey there its Dr Justin
Marchegiani we are live here with Evan Brand in the house. Feel free and chime in some of your questions. Today’s podcast is gonna be a part two on
anxiety. We’re gonna be connecting gut health to
anxiety. We’re gonna be talking about some lab test
that we can use to assess the root cause of a-why you may be anxious or moody. So I’m really excited to dive in. Evan Brand: Yeah man, me too. So I’ll just start with my personal, and
I don’t know if you experience much anxiety. I don’t think you’ve ever really said
“Hey, I’ve had anxiety” but I definitely did, when I had gut infections. When I had ___[0:35], when I had parasites,
when I had bacterial overgrowth, when I had candida overgrowth and when I had kind of
a quadruple ___[0:43] that I really think stemmed from me during a round of antibiotics
after I got my wisdom teeth and my 12-year molar extracted, you know I had a round of
antibiotics after both of those procedures. I think that’s what led to the candida and
then probably started to tore away, uh, tear away my gut barrier and then I ended up getting
leaky gut situation. You go swimming Barton springs a few times,
you swallow some creek water, you get some parasites down in your gut and then all of
a sudden everything falls apart and you’re anxious for no reason. So that was at least my, my story, my unusual
experience with anxiety ‘cause I’m not an anxious person by nature, but that made
me anxious when I had those gut bugs. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Totally makes sense. I mean gut health is so important because
all of your nutrients get absorbed through your gut. So, just a kind of review of physiology because
we wanna connect the physiology and the biochemistry to why you feel the way you feel. That way you’re not just taking doctor’s
orders, you’re understanding how these things are working. So, so we have our stomach, where we chew
up our food, we swallow, it goes down our esophagus into our stomach. Digestion starts when the mouth gets chewing
so just chewing up our good proteins is gonna be huge. That starts the digestion process and increases
the surface area for hydrochloric acid, and enzymes in the stomach. So we increase hydrochloric acid in the stomach
that lowers the pH it makes it more acidic, like ‘cause pH is lower. And that activates certain ___[02:07] enzymes
in our stomach like ___[02:08] which starts that protein digestion process, that nicely
enters, that enters into our small intestine, which then triggers ___[02:16] so we start
breaking down the fat, fats are important because vitamin A, D, E, and K have instrumental
effects on our physiology. Fats ___[02:25] vitamins especially, uhm,
you know vitamin d for example, for instance has some effects at helping with mood as well. And we also know vitamin K, and vitamin A
are really important for, uh, thyroid function and we know thyroid can have a major implication
on mood as well, so low vitamin A, low thyroid. But in general all of these proteins and amino
acids and even these minerals, these tranquilizing minerals, like magnesium, help our body relax. They chill out our heart, they chill out our
mood. ___[02:55] amino acids get broken down in
our stomach. They get ionized in our stomach and get reabsorbed
again our small intestine. So we know that digestive processes are so
important for these nutrients getting to where they need be is important so we can feel good. Evan Brand: Talking to your microphone go
close like this. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah. Evan Brand: I’m not sure if that’s – I
think you might be using your built in microphone. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh lemme double check
that. Evan Brand: ‘Cause I sounds a little echoey. Go on, uh, go on your little gear box on Hangouts
there, see if you see Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Oh yep, you’re right. How about now? Evan Brand: Much – a million times better. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Okay, I apologize
for that everyone. So we got a better mic up and ready to go,
ex- Evan Brand: We, we still heard you but, now
we’ve got that show, that studio quality gone. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Love it. Evan Brand: So here’s the deal. Everything you said makes a perfect sense,
assuming, you’re actually digesting and assimilating all these nutrients and breaking
everything down like you said. And so where the domino goes bad, I mean for
a lot of people, it’s just being prescribed in acid blocking medication. So you may think, well, how in the world does
anxiety tie in to me being ___[02:55] or some acid blocker. Uhm, the way Justin described it, it was perfect. You take all these amino acids from your dietary
protein, assuming you’re eating those. You know for eating a bagel, and, you know,
cream cheese for breakfast, that’s not gonna cut it, you know. We’re eating a good, you know, we’re eating
a good quality meat, a bacon, a sausage, you know handful of pecans, uh, half of avocado,
you know, some blueberries, that’s a hell of a breakfast. If you’re eating that, you’re gonna beginning
some amino acids that can be broken down and therefore turned into, for one, create muscle
tissue- Dr. Justin Marchegiani: ___[02:55] Evan Brand: Uh, create neurotransmitters. But, if you’re on an acid blocker because
you had heartburn and you in one visit with your doctor and they say “Okay you need
to be on an acid blocker” you could start that whole domino effect against your health
just from something that simple and then you end up with anxiety so then you get referred
to your psychiatric doctor and they put you on Xanax and, and, and it’s not a Xanax
deficiency, it was the acid blocker messed up our digestion, your digestion issues created
the inability for you to absorb your amino acids and make brain chemicals. Now you’re anxious and depressed, so then
you get put on anti-depressants. So before you know it in three seconds you’re
on an anti-depressants, an anti-anxiety, and on acid blocker. And then maybe you can’t sleep good because
just as mentioned you’re breaking down these relaxing things like you’re getting magnesium
from your diet. So if you don’t have enough of that, or
let’s say you don’t have enough B6 to convert serotonin to melatonin, now you’re
not sleeping well so then you get on the fourth med which is a sleep drug. I mean this is how what happens, this is why
an average person is on multiple pharmaceuticals. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and I don’t
even think you talked about uh, cholesterol medications on there as well, right? Evan Brand: No I didn’t. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Because cholesterol
is gonna be the building block for all your hormones so then you have, maybe your cholesterol’s
starting to creep up because of inflammation or you’re doing too much carbohydrate which
stimulates insulin, insulin jacks up your cholesterol inflammation will also do it too,
so for eating inflammatory foods that could do it. And then now your cholesterol’s high, you’re
prescribed to ___[05:58] and then the ___[05:59] gonna decrease your, uhm, ___[06:01] production
so now your ___[06:02] lower. Your building blocks for your hormones are
lower and we know ___[06:05] have other conitive mood side effects as well so that’s gonna
create more issues. And then from there after that you’re on
a libido medication like a viagra, uhm, or something like or xalexa to help with ED and
that’s create more side effects and more issues and then God forbid you got some mood
issues. You go, if you’re a female now, you got
top your conventional doctor, their typically gonna recommend birth control pill or even
___[06:33] on top of that, then you’re just screwed. Because stacking one medication on top of
another medication and then all these medication have various side effects that you treat with
other medications. And then these medications also create nutritional
deficiency. So birth control pills will lower Magnesium,
Zinc and certain B vitamins which are really important in ethylating ___[06:55] your neuro
transmitters so it’s just really important especially Magnesium for calming and relaxing
your heart. For helping, let’s say, be the shifter between
your sympathetic and parasympathetic nervous system. Meaning, parasympathetic, relaxation. Sympathetic, stress, go, go, go. We need the ability to downshift from sympathetic
of stress and go, to the parasympathetic, relaxation and chill out. Evan Brand: Well let’s add one more drug
to the mix, that are hundred, that are hundred million Americans are on which is blood pressure
medication. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: -Right. Evan Brand: And Valsartan and all these commonly
prescribed blood pressure medications are all getting recalled now due to containing
carcinogenic chemical, you know. There’s like, this type in Valsartan cancer,
you can look the research yourself, and these people get put on blood pressure medication
because they can’t regulate their blood pressure because as you mentioned, you lose
that parasympathetic-sympathetic balance, you’re depleted in Magnesium because you’re
not digesting, because you got gut infections or you’re on acid blocker. So now you’re acid blocker, antianxiety,
antidepressant, you’re on like you said, Xalexa, and now you’re on blood pressure,
and then you’re on ___[08:01] at all the same time. None of that is gonna, you know, none of that
is gonna contribute to a long healthy life. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: No, none of it will,
man. So really important, we’re trying to get
to the root underlying cause here. So, let’s shift gears on the lab testing. There are some lab testing we go to see what’s
going on. Number one, just looking at your digestion. Just doing a comprehensive gut test, look
at inflammation in your gut. Inflammation in our br- inflammation in our
gut will create an inflammation in our brain. That activates the cell called microglial
cell, which are essentially immune cells in our brain. When they are activated, they will create
a, you know, brain fog. So you know, you know obviously that the more
foggy you are, the more anxious you could feel as well. So inflammation in the gut could create inflammation
in the brain. So we gotta look at gut functions. We wanna look at a comprehensive gut test,
that’s gonna assess inflammation in the gut, like ___[08:50]. Wanna look at your IGA, your immune levels,
because your immune system is over active, that could be a sucking up a lot of resources,
right. So, for instance, the more your immune system
is overactive, that’s like the equivalent of you, let’s just say, leaving the water
on in one of the guest bedrooms in your house that you never go to. Water builds huge, and you don’t know why,
because you’re not using a lot of water but there’s water being used in the background,
it’s kinda like that. You have all these immune resources that are
being used in the background, cause your immune system is chronically firing off, so your
immune function. Next is looking at various candida overgrowth,
yeast overgrowth, which have a huge effect because they produce various acid ___[09:32]
and toxic byproducts. And they also create chemicals that makes
you crave a whole bunch of sugary stuff. So it becomes harder to stay on a good diet
to your template. Next would be SIBO or various bacterial overgrowth. Whether it’s ___[09:44 – 09:48]. These are all bacterial overgrowth that are
despotic meaning bad, so we have more of the bad stuff and less of the beneficial probiotics
like lactobacillus ___[09:55] and then we have various parasitic infections. ___[10:00 – 10:06] various parasitic infections. And ___[10:08] h pylori which is some kind
of bacterial infection too, or worms. Evan Brand: I’ve seen a lot of crypto the
last few weeks, it’s very interesting because during the winter I didn’t see much crypto
so I don’t know if that’s because people, for their self maybe are like, Texas, Florida,
California clients maybe they’re getting back in Creekson rivers or streams or lakes
for the season or what. But I haven’t seen much crypto and then
over the last three weeks I’ve seen, I don’t know, probably fifteen to twenty people, including
children, even as young as age 2 or 3 years old, Dr. Justin Marchegiani: (Crosstalk.) Wow. Evan Brand: Those cryptosprodium, I tell you
for personal experience it causes a lot of stomach pain, nausea, it can cause appetite
swing, or sometimes you sit down at the dinner table you just can’t eat, you’re just
not hungry and obviously, anxiety belong with that because now, if you’re getting robbed
of your nutrition because of crypto, you’re not gonna be absorbing your amino acids, and
then you can’t make your ___[11:01] for example. Now, you’re tired, you’re wired, you’re
stressed, and you just don’t know why. So, um, you did a great job on talking about
stool test, you mentioned the candida, we, you find candida on the stool test when you
and I look at that. However, we often find it more accurately
on the organic acids panel because we’re gonna measure the gases that candida produces
rather than the actual candida itself. So in the stool, we’re trying to find the
DNA of candida which is a little harder to do, so we often see a lot of false negatives
on stool testing. So this is why, we just can’t quickly compare
or contrast your conventional gastroenterologist that you get referred to. They’re not gonna be running these type
of tests, maybe on ten or twenty years, that could be the whole standard, for right now
they’re not running these tests. So even if they did they called it “stool
test”, their stool test could not be probably as intensive as the technology we are using
because we are kinda on the bleeding edge here. So that being said, the organic acids’ profile,
we’’l look at the gacids. And when we look at the gacids, you can also
look at the other fungus too, so we can even look at the things in their environment like
mold, because on page 1, of the ___[12:05] there’s different markers that hide in candida
but there’s also different markers that we’ve found that indicate ___[12:11] of
mold. So you could have mold in your sinus cavity
as so close to your brain it can go to the blood brain barrier and that will cause anxiety
too. So now we’re talking about, fixing someone’s
sinus infection as well as fixing their gut infection, and fixing their home environment. Their home environment because potentially
as we’ve seen people like in Florida had one client who shits too much candida in their
house. We did this little petri dishes for her house,
she shits so much candida in her house, so much anxiety and we fixed her gut and three
months later she’s got a white tongue again. The candida comes back and so we give her
herbs again, her gut gets better, and then candida comes back. Say we need to test your house, so we test
her house, the candida in her house is off the chart. So now what we did is we did the fogger, we
fogged her house with the essential oils and the candida in the house is gone. So now she’s staying free and clear of the
candida overgrowth. So, this is why you gotta take a step than
even the functional medicine people saying “fix the gut, fix the gut, fix the gut”
now you gotta fix the home, microbio home as well as well as your internal microbio
home. You can’t just cherry pick. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, and for every
person this may not be the root issue but it’s important. Yeah especially if we can do history and you
feel bad or coming out of the house or we can even just start with a decent play testing. And even from the ___[13:26] micro toxin collection
after that and if we can see, we can put a check in each one of those boxes ___[13:34]
confidence that what we have to start dealing with the home environment right? Evan Brand: Yeah, exactly yes. The home, you know, like, like you said it’s
not everyone. Like, I’m kinda over paranoid about the
issue now so I’m checking some of the houses. But I’m only finding maybe 20% of the people
were testing their home or showing up with the problem. There’s a lot of people coming out, their
home is perfectly fine and I just say you know what for a hundred fifty bucks US it’s
worth the peace of mind. Work the plates, check your numbers, and worst
case scenario I’m wrong and your home is not contributing to your anxiety or other
health problems. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I hundred percent
agree, and also uhm, one of the things that you brought to my attention is very interesting
is that you may have no history of water damage or no apparent water damage in your house
at all but you may just have a high amount of moisture in your house because of the climate
you live in, and one of the things that you did was you invested in a good quality dehumidifier
attached to your ___[14:29] to pull the humidity out of the air. Which then makes harder for mold to grow because
mold needs that humidity over fifty percent in the house for it to grow so you were able
to decrease the humidity because there’s certain times where you may not have an air-conditioner
on. Uhm because you know it’s, it’s sixty
or seventy degrees out or fifty degrees out but the humidity still high even though the
temperature’s low and that’s one of the benefits that you have of having a cool house
to humidifier attached to your ___[14:56] to suck out that moisture which prevents the
fuel source for this mold to grow. Evan Brand: Right, and in the spring you’d
love to have the windows open right so actually we did this over the weekend, we opened up
all the windows. There was one day we have like seventy, seventy-two
degrees out so it’s perfect. We opened all the windows up but then I go
downstairs and I heard the dehumidifier’s running just in overtime and I go look at
the percentage and their up to fifty two percent. So people they opened up their window and
mold grows on fifty or above. When you’re like oh, the weather’s beautiful,
let’s leave the window’s open for a week straight, you know, or let’s leave the windows
open all night or let’s leave the windows open every day all day. That’s allowing all that moist air from
outside, assuming that’s the climate’s moist, to come inside, and that’s increasing
the humidity in the home. I love the idea, you know, open the windows,
ten to fifteen minutes a day, let fresh air come in, wash out from all the ___[15:46],
wash out from all the VOCs in your home, but, you don’t wanna do it all the time. A friend of mine, a mutual friend of our’s,
Daniel Vitalessi, who lives up in Maine, it’s so moist up there. Uh, I can’t, I don’t remember the full
details but I remember him saying about having a mold problem on his previous houses, and
it might consider at the podcast, he left his windows open all the time. ‘Cause he like to live in the woods, and
he love the sounds of nature and all that so he had his windows open all the time. But I mean all that moisture was just forming
on his window sills and so you gotta, you gotta think about the building materials that
we’re using. Like our ancestors they were outside all the
time, you know, but they had like a buffalo hide, they had bison hide, you know, they
didn’t have dry wall, and uh, you know, treated wood and all those sort of stuff. They didn’t have the same building materials
that we used today. So, try to compare, “Oh my grandma she lived
in the summer and she have air conditioning and her windows are open all the time,”
yeah, but her house wasn’t probably made with modern dry wall. So those materials could withstand moisture,
our modern day materials are more moisture sensitive. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. Yup, hundred- Evan Brand: It’s a bit of a tangible. Let’s go back to the testing. So, we didn’t talk about adrenal testing
for anxiety, I mean that was one of my problems too is, uh, I would feel pretty good during
the day but then at night I would feel anxious before I would go to bed, and I have that
night time spike of cortisol that we often see. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Yeah, so what we do
is we look at the cortisol rhythm throughout the day and then the cortisol rhythm gives
you a window to how your cortisol, how the outer part of your adrenal glands are doing. So we look at this high to low to lower to
lowest type of taper. These tapers are important because it’s
set by our HPA access. So we start to see these regulations lower
by the morning or higher at night or it’s kind of bouncing around like we call the pinball
effect. It’s pinballing that could create mood issues
number one. Number two, we also look at the inner part
of the adrenal glands called the medulla which make a lot of adrenaline. Adrenaline or no adrenaline, same thing as
epinephrine and norepinephrine, medicine uses a lot of words to say the same thing. So, we’d also wanna look at that, ‘cause
if we’re really stimulating a lot of adrenaline or no adrenaline that’s helpful to know
so we’d wanna run a good cortisol rhythm test to look at free and total cortisol which
is great. We’d also wanna look at some of the uh,
amino acid metabolizer or some of these neurotransmitters. Like, we’d look at vanilmandelate to get
a window at adrenaline metabolism. We’d look at homovanillate to get a window
to dopamine metabolism. And also you’d wanna get a window into B6
because B6, especially at folate and B12 are really important for methylation. And a lot of these brain chemicals like epinephrine
and adrenaline, ___[18:28] they need to get methylated. So we, we need these carbon hydrogens to bind
it to methylated, to activate it and that requires sulphur amino acids so if we’re
excessively stressed or really methylating our brain chemicals ‘sause we’re making
a lot of adrenaline, we’re gonna be burying under a lot of sulphur amino acids as well. And we need sulphur amino acids also to detoxify,
we may not have a lot of extra sulphur left over to run ___[18:58] we may not have enough
of these sulphur compounds to run these other accessory pathways which are really important
for what? Detoxifying us from mold, heavy metals, various
organic chlorine, pesticides, or stressors in the environment so that’s why it’s
really important to look at these other accessory nutrients that are involved in the stress
handling response. Evan Brand: Yeah, let’s take what you said. Let’s dig further. So now you’re deficient in sulphur, you’re
not detoxifying properly. You do get exposed to pesticides, go out to
a restaurant with your family on a weekend and have a good dinner knowingly eating pesticide
and that’s gonna kill off good bacteria in your gut. Those good bacteria are supposed to make your
brain chemicals so now we go back all the way to anxiety again. So it is this kinda self-repeating cycle. So this why you can’t just focus on one
aspect of your body. You can’t just put all your eggs on the
gut basket, all your eggs on the adrenal basket. This is why Justin and I don’t really say,
you know, you know, word expert at adrenals, word expert at gut, or word expert at this
or that, because if you go in with the microscope and you’re just looking with this one problem,
like you could see the thyroid, and see that there’s a problem with the thyroid, that
could cause anxiety too, right? Like if you have Hashimoto’s you’ve got
antibodies that attack the thyroid and you get a little bit of hormone into the bloodstream
that could cause anxiety for sure. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: (Cross-talking.) Yeah. Evan Brand: I mean we didn’t talk about
that extensively. However, if we just focus on thyroid, okay
we’ll gonna give you ___[20:24] or something else to calm the thyroid, did we fix the problem
why the thyroid is auto immune in the first place. We fixed the immune system attacking the thyroid
by looking at adrenals, and gut and chemicals, all that. Or we just give someone herb to calm the thyroid
and that was all we did. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: (Cross-talking.) Right. Evan Brand: Because if we did just that, then
we fail. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Correct, and I’m
seeing this more and more with various functional medicine doctors that are out there. What I’m seeing there are people, just the
thyroid functional person, just the gut functional person. There’s nothing wrong with that marketing
stampone, and like I’m gonna market to those people but I’m gonna look at everything
once they’re in there, I get that. That’s kinda where my focus is. You wanna reach out the people so they ___[21:06]
with you but you’re still looking at the whole thing. I’m seeing people, I’m seeing people only
focusing on just the thyroid. Or only focused on just the gut. And then I’m looking at their labs, I’m
seeing these people coming to me as patients and I’m like, oh its’-it’s really too
bad because had an anemia and anemia was missed because this person was only focused on the
thyroid or hey, this person had an adrenal issue or other issues going on and they were
only focused on the gut, they didn’t fix those other things. Does that make sense? Evan Brand: (Cross-talking.) It does. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: So just be careful. A lot of people out there are focused on,
you know they’re focused on, they’re reaching to functional medicine practitioners that
are marketing one thing and another for their anxiety but they may be missing in the treatment
a whole body system that’s so important. So, when people are out there looking for
functional medicine doctors, you know, if you find someone that you like that’s great,
just make sure when you interview them, when you talk to them make sure they’re gonna
be looking at all the underlying systems, not just focused on one system like the gut
or one system like just the adrenals. Make sure you’re looking at the whole thing. Evan Brand: Yeah, I think over the next five
to ten years this is gonna be a bigger problem just because of the Internet. The Internet allows us do what we do, and
we are very grateful for the opportunity. But that also allows other people to go pick
up some high profile credential and then market a specific flavour of functional medicine. Like, I’m gonna be the hormone girl, and
I had a woman last week and she went to this hormone functional medicine specialist and
the lady’s loosing hair, in clumps and clumps and clumps every time she takes a shower,
and we look at her blood work, and she’s never been – she goes to this hormone lady,
I don’t know how, a hormone functional medicine never tested her, never tested her blood,
didn’t look at her ferritin, ferritin level was a six. The lady can hardly catch her breath, she’s
got major anxiety, she’s losing tons of hair. Like, look at your ferritin, like, if you
don’t fix that, you’re not gonna get your hair back no matter what this lady tells you
about your bio identical hormone plant. So, it’s just that, it’s – I think it
just comes with the territory of this because as you say people are trying to market, but
you gotta make sure that they’re turning over all the rocks. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: (Cross-talking.) Yes. Evan Brand: ‘Cause last thing you wanted
to do is go spink like two to three thousand dollars and then now you gotta start all over
because you didn’t address the other stuff. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: You want the complete
picture. Let’s connect this with some other things. Obviously we have female hormone issues like
progesterone, low oestrogen or oestrogen dominance if you’re a cycling female. Obviously we have the menopausal kinda side
where the hormones could just be low across the board, and we’re starting to have a
lot of menopausal symptoms, from low progesterone, low oestrogen, because now our follicles,
our ovarian follicles are used up. And then we have obviously on the cycling
side, where we’re having a lot of PMS, a lot oestrogen dominance and we have lower
progesterone, and that could be another component because progesterone is a GABA Chloride channel
opener. So it opens those GABA Chloride channel in
the brain, and allows us to relax. A lot of people could have a lower progesterone,
oestrogen dominance, or just lower hormones across the board if you’re on the menopausal
side. And the crazy thing is, we can also have similar
symptoms if our thyroid is also low. This is why it’s so important to why you
cannot just, just create a market and for one thing but it’s really important that
you look at the whole component to make sure, other patients were hey, thyroid was the missing
key to their anxiety, some it was low progesterone, some it was a combination of the two. And unless you’re treating and looking at
it, and also treating it, then you know, you’ll know from you know, from experience what levers
is moving what. Evan Brand: Yeah, and I briefly hit on the
Hashimoto’s, I think we should talk about it for a second because this is such a common
issue. We’re seeing women with all sorts of different
levels of thyroid antibodies. From the tens to the hundreds to the thousands. When the immune system is going after the
thyroid, the first thought is, well, we’ve gotta calm down the immune system, we’d
better try to stop this attack on the thyroid, but really, it’s fine at the first thought,
but really what we’re seeing is we have to be addressing the other causes, if you
give someone like a thyroid multivitamin, like it’s got your Selenium, and your Chronium,
and and ___[25:18] and all those stuff. That’s good on a theory but you could stay
on a thyroid multivitamin for five years and still never get to the root cause. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Absolutely. All the thing that I would think is at the
low hanging fruit perspective ___[25:30]. So of course gluten sensitivity can create
GAD antiobodies and GAD is glutamate, uh, glutamate decarboxylase enzyme which is the
enzyme that helps make, uh, uh, helps make GABA in the brain and GABA is that nice inhibitory
relaxation chemical, so GABA’s important, gluten’s a strong component in that ___[25:50]
response. But also gluten can drive, uhm, Hashimoto’s
and that you will see increase in thyroid peroxidase and thyroglobulin antibodies. And these antibodies are gonna stimulate attack
on the thyroid, attack the thyroid, and you may spill out hormone and as that hormone
spills out to rev up the metabolism create swings of anxiety there as well. Evan Brand: Have you ever experienced that,
I mean you talked about your story with Hashimoto’s. have you ever had a day or a week or a time
in your life where maybe a stress or, you know, uh, when you first had your son you’ve
had like high in stress did you ever feel like “Oh my God” like “My Hashimoto’s
is kicking in” did you feel that or- Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I definitely had episodes
where I felt like blood sugar fluctuations and that cortisol adrenaline blood sugar swing
___[26:39] issues in the past and I feel that potentially previous gluten exposures have
potentially revved up the thyroid and had created some of those symptoms as well. Yeah I have in the past for sure. I tried to medicate that as soona s possible- Evan Brand: Yeah, but it’s not fun the blood
sugar piece you implied you hit them. Let’s, let’s – I know we hit that kind
on Anxiety Part One, but with the blood sugar, you know in terms of testing, right? We talked about hormones; we talked about
gut, organic acids, etcetera… Blood sugar testing, how simple and easy is
that? If you’re feeling anxious, I mean I had
a time where I had impending doom. I thought my god, the world’s gonna end,
something bad is about to happen. I don’t know what it is, I checked my blood
sugar, it was a fifty nine. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: (Cross talking.) Yeah, yeah. Evan Brand: I mean, whoa. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: I know, I know. That’s gonna be an issue because low blood
sugar will drive a lot of cortisol adrenaline to pick it up. Now again if you’re fully ___[27:30] adapted
that’s better because you have a lot more ketones there but I still think, uhm, even
when you’re blood sugar’s that low could definitely create some issues for sure. Evan Brand: Yeah, so if you have anxiety,
I mean, don’t automatically think oh it’s Hashimoto’s, it may might not be. It could be something simple like low blood
sugar or high blood pressure. You know when I was having some blood pressure
swings, I noticed when the pressure was high, a side effect of that increased blood pressure,
was anxiety. So do you take anti-anxiety herbs or do you
think blood pressure herbs? For me, it was a combination of both. I took, like, inhibitory things to support
GABA, you know ___[28:09] etcetera and I also did some hawthorn berry and some folate and
some other things to help blood pressure. I kinda worked on both. That’s why really, people, you know, email
us and say “Oh doctor J can you just give me a protocol for my Hashimoto’s?” It’s like, do you see how bad of a question
that is? It’s like we have no idea what the heck
is going on. Or can you just give me “Doctor J give me
a parasite protocol” We have no idea what’s going on. Like, give me an anxiety protocol. You can’t do that because what’s the mechanism? What is the mechanism behind it? So, you know, in the long run you’re gonna
spend so much more money knowing the whole foods or in Amazon buying this anxiety supplement
bust, you know, stress busting supplement. Like, might help, probably won’t hurt, but,
get the testing done. Get the data, get the rocks turned over. I can’t tell you how much time I wasted
just taking this random herb for energy, random herb for sleep. And I had no idea what I was up against. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Hundred percent. Well, excellent thoughts here today. I think we laid some, some good references
for various mechanisms. How we can go down this path and of course
how the gut is intimately connected. And I talked about the auto immune mechanism
a minute ago, just kinda gonna dovetail on that because today’s podcast is on gut health
and anxiety. A lot of that mechanism happens and works
because of gut prebio ability. So with leaky gut and gut prebio ability have
that mechanism where we have that undigested, whether it’s yeast or bacteria or foods
include in our casein compounds get into that bloodstream through the gut lining right. We have our tight junctions, they open up
especially with exposure to gluten and casein and potentially other endo toxins and fungus
metabolites. They’re gonna open up these things get into
our bloodstream and then our immune system is now exposed to it or these things now exposed
to our immune system and can really heighten that auto immune system response now. And then that’s part of what’s going on
here. So auto immunity is a big issue especially
if someone’s anxiety is connected to a thyroid issue, there’s a good chance that thyroid
issue is auto immunity nature, and then acts the part of it. Evan Brand: Yeah. How simple of a thought. Like your, your dinner at the pasta restaurant
could be driving your anxiety in your auto immune condition. Well it’s very well possible. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Well, excellent. Today’s a phenomenal podcast. To everyone listening if you wanna dive deeper
with Evan head over evanbrand.com you can schedule a consult with Evan. If you wanna dive deeper with myself justinhealth.com
click the arrow we can schedule a consult and dive in deeper. Yeah some of the labs we talked about today
we’ll put links down beneath the podcast. You can access some of these labs, uhm, some
of the gut tests are really important. Some of the adrenal tests, some of the neurotransmitter
metabolite tests we’ll make sure we have links down below as well. Evan, any other questions, comments or concerns? Evan Brand: I would just say don’t give
up if you do need some type of anti-anxiety medication or something prescribed temporarily
while you’re working on the root cause. I’m not judging you for that, neither is
Doctor J. The point is we want you to get to the root of this and we see so many people
that they wanna get off their pharmaceutical medications and they don’t know how. This is your road map to do so keep your head
up, keep focusing on “What else have I not done yet? What other rock do I need to turn over My
blood test, and my doctor said I’m fine.” Well there blood test probably sucked, get
a better blood test, figure out what the heck is going on. Dr. Justin Marchegiani: Exactly. You guys liked the show here put some comments
down below. I love to hear what you think, like to get
suggestions on future episodes. Give us a thumbs up or might share as well. Really appreciate it. Evan, today was great man, we’ll be in touch
and we’ll talk this week. Take care everyone here. Bye bye. Evan Brand: Bye bye.

8 thoughts on “Gut Health and Anxiety | Podcast #227

  1. Evan & Justin, So thankful you two put this specific share together! Quite the masterful cumulative of such a dynamically interconnected understanding as to how broken links create the chain reactive experiences within our mind/body – physical/mental wellness, where it all begins as well as which factors contribute towards the dis-ease within one's bodily vessel!
    * Exceptional collaboration gentlemen! ๐Ÿ•Š๐Ÿ™‡โ€โ™‚๏ธ๐Ÿ’“๐Ÿ™๐Ÿ•Š

  2. Such a nice doctor. You explain things easily and don't talk too fast like a lot of other doctors in I tube. My ferrit in level is 22 and the doctor out me on slow release iron. How long does it take to get the level up? I also know that I have suclinical hypothyroid. The doctor says it's all normal. But at one point my the was 3.38 and the reverse t 3 was on the high range too. I have been taking a thyroid supplement and eating Brazil nuts for selenium. I am burping all of the time, when I wake up, after I eat, etc. What do you think could be causing it?

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