Brandon Zemp: Hey guys, it’s July 31. I’m in Vancouver BC right now absolutely love it up here. On this episode of the podcast. Renee Wong, CEO of cast box joins me as a guest. We discuss a few different things. We discussed the monetization via live cast and new feature on cast box, the beginning of a token ecosystem for podcasters. And we answer some live questions from the audience on life cast. I should probably mention that cast box is one of the most popular podcast players in the world, and has won numerous awards. Renee also does her best jobs communicate all this in English. So if there’s some parts you don’t quite understand, definitely go back and take your time listening to it. I would also like to note that I’m giving away free signed copies of my book, The Satoshi sequence. So if you’d like a free signed copy, send me an email at [email protected] to find out how you can get your free signed copy of my book. Alright guys, enjoy. Oh, I can hear you now. Hear me? Renee Wang: Yeah, yeah. Hi. Brandon Zemp: How you doing? Renee Wang: Brandon? So yeah, I’m good. I’m glad that we can talk. Cool. Brandon Zemp: Yeah, yeah. This is awesome. Yeah. I love the future. feature. Live cast and everything. Yeah, it’s going really well. I love playing around with it. It’s kind of cool. I mean, you can do this whole, pre and post like chat now for like podcast and like radio shows and stuff. And it’s on the phone. Yeah, I got to play with this one. This is awesome. Renee Wang: Yeah. Oh, do to the record. So after the conversation, you can get to the audio file. Brandon Zemp: Okay. Definitely. I think the audio was with my headphones. Renee Wang: Okay. Brandon Zemp: I think it was on my computer. So I don’t think there’s anything wrong with the software. Where the where the platform, but yeah. Thanks for coming on. Really appreciate it. I’m sure most people here and that will be listening to it know who you are already. But do you want to give like a brief background? For the listeners? Renee Wang: Yeah, sure. I’m Renee. I’m the founder and CEO of cash box. And now we are in cast well, so basically, I didn’t need to spend too much, you know, detail about the cast box. Yeah, but I think I quit my job. I had to go to Japan and found the the passports about four years ago. And and the now I think has always been the biggest third party podcast, a pure play podcast app. And they also have some innovations like live cast, your your search community, try to make the audio things more social, more community driven. And yeah, and now Now, as you know, we have a team of like, almost 70 members have more than half our engineering focusing on improving the product. Yeah, but still, we are, you know, on the early stage with to bring more innovations and creative ideas into the industry. Yeah, that’s a very brief introduction, you Brandon Zemp: know, cashbox, has been awesome, it’s definitely been gaining a lot of recognition, it’s won a bunch of awards and everything. So tell me a little bit about live cast and how that kind of is a new feature. And that adds value to the platform. Renee Wang: Yeah, I think um, because you in the past four years, he called me the podcasters there are two major points, I mean, two major pain point for for them. And first is engage with users because nowadays, creating a podcast is a long long process from finding a hosting platform tool, you know, to the record, if you are using interview how to find the Skype or some other you know, software to do the call and do the record to the editor, and another upload hosting and then distribute and then go to every single channels to find feedback if they have it, and ask the followers to go back to their the hostess social media to get together and decide. So this is kind of a hosting is really hard for creators and the listeners to engage with each other. So try to find a way to to try to short shorten the loop between you know, between creating content to get into the battery is one of the major you know, major issues that are facing for hosting holsters are facing nowadays. So this is one one thing we want to solve. The second biggest, you know, thing is for monetization, because previously we have a Patreon together donation, but because for Patreon you have to go to you know, go to a third party in a Patreon website, link to have access to credit card information want to donate to some old like TP to some like you know favorite your favorite host. So the process is longer and it will you know, it will make the commercial rate lower. But here you know busines is busines alive cast, we try to ideas kind of like a feature. peaking features, for example, now adjusting a cloud, which is I purchased by, you know, by coins, and in Google Play, and I post all and then and after I gave to a powerhouse the virtual Gator you can cash out. Because in this way, during the very live conversations, you know, the host is the host if they know they are really doing a great job. And if so listeners want to appreciate the great content that the host has created. So they kind of do the real time kind of like donation real time supporting. So it may become me later it will become a whole vwo compounds a major monetization China for the podcasters. So basically, as I mentioned, there are like two, two things we want to solve is engagement, why is monetization for the host. So that’s why we create a webcast. And actually, I think this is quite new feature in the podcast industry. But I really hope you know this too, but this tool will be free. It’s not it’s free, and it will be free forever. So we really do hope, you know, podcaster can leverage this tool, you know, to build a better user base and, and someday when they get, you know, more loyal users to come can’t get them all monetization monetization method. Yeah. Brandon Zemp: Absolutely, like the monetization to it’s awesome for creators. And I know we were talking before this a little bit about some like virtual assets that you’ll be able to use to contribute to the creators or vice versa, like during like a live cast. How does that all work? Renee Wang: This is a wonderful gift, it was purchased by coin and a coin was was available on you know, it is a cash bar so you can purchase via Google Play or Apple style by the app, you know, you have to purchase IP and then for our con that user said and the host of your cannabis one stop and then it’s over like Linda stop you know worth over 10 US dollars they can go to the website the hosting platform to try to cash out they can cash out both Android and web set because our eyes to the support casual he says Apple but they can’t go to the hour that they have to have time they can go to the website or Android version to cash out into the real cash and we will pay them well PayPal to go directly to their paypal account. So this is the process is like a very easy and the people didn’t worry about too many other kind of like like a credit card will take over or like no taking about money like a payment method. Because for users very easy just like a gift or like a kind of like like a gaming is as a game in there some kind of like people to give to their kind of some some different kind of like a way to to to support podcasters and maybe in the later we try to you know we try to adding more features Not today but in the later when Livecasters get more audience we try to do more promotion inside the users and try to educate their you know, they are educated their behaviors to give you more, you know to to kind of lighten the mood or to keep there are lots of like because I as a matter is less like a game so there’s a lot of like our methodology in gaming industry that try Will you increase the increase the monetization rate. So because they try to say for example, every new users maybe later you to jump into the live classroom, we can give them some some Watergate and, and maybe find some other situations if users can finish some Tasker. We can’t do the mobile to give and then they are using the video games to appreciate to show appreciation to their host and then they can get this kind of like a reward after giving the one who gave him the host IO really appreciate it thank you for for supporting me and it it makes users feel good. And it will increase their you know their ppl ppl behaviors in the long run. So that would be something that they can they can you know, we can improve in the future. But nowadays, I think they leave still focusing on try to bring pastors mo listeners and because they have a bigger listener base in the future they can how more possibility to get higher marketization. Yeah, Brandon Zemp: that’s awesome. It sounds a lot like what steam it and basic attention token we’re working on. But the features on this already are really cool. And I can already see how everything’s gonna work together. And I also saw that you were the co founder for content box and content boxes kind of similar as well. Can you explain what that is? A little bit? Renee Wang: Yeah, sure. I think on the box. It’s mobility. Now the infrastructure, the technology knowledge infrastructure level. So for the application level, I think it still may take two or three more years in to go to the application. So for contentbox, and another co founder of contentbox is who used to be a scientist in Facebook focusing on distributed and networking. So for cannabis VR mo try to build the blockchain based a decentralized the ecosystem or infrastructure and try to support a different kind of like, like a kind of like, content consumption, content consumption in the future. For example, maybe in the long run older, see, very individual creators can create their own token. And they can actually, like kind of pre sell their own token like Kickstarter, but only for word digital content. And then for every people nowadays, for example. So if you go to Kickstarter to say that, Oh, I’m going to do a do a podcast with this kind of script or this kind of idea, you you can you can try to do the Kickstarter to give me some some kind of like launch pad, go to the mini launch pad to to fund me, but nowadays in Kickstarter, every single people who do the who giving the money they can nothing, maybe they can get a kind of a T shirt or something are kind of like some maybe a T shirt or maybe a bag with a logo, but basically they can enjoy they cannot share a portion of the revenue in the future, but we can solve that in the blockchain because all the things are open source, all the things all the money foundation can be recorded on the on chain. So, so basically, as I mentioned, are individual, individual comic creator, they can create their own toolkit, and they can sell their own token to some of their early adopters of aulakh or fans or followers of his previous content. And by by getting the getting the you know, selling the poker, they can get some money to do to maybe to find a better writer to you know, to re to improve the script, they can find a really great actor to, to produce the content that they can take half using the monies of the foundations to buy some, you know, devices or something equipments. And, and, and, and by the insulator wants to counter was alive, every money. I mean, I agree. I mean, every minute who ground Neeleman they sell the content in the future, when the content is alive, every average dollars, when they when they guide by the content, they can share a portion to the early investors, it’s much like a kind of like have a small IPO is kind of like for every people who buy your stock, they can share a portion of the company, but by by blockchain by by the accountant boss, every early adopter, early investors have this kind of like small token sale, and they can get a kind of like a security token, which means that they can share a small portion of the content in the future. And all the things can be done automatically on chain, there’ll be will be no flout, there will be no, no needed form for people to do the do the checking. So but as I mentioned, we are still not doing so very basic infrastructure level things. What I mentioned of this kind of scenario must to be built once once the infrastructure is built, and it’s in the middle where it’s built, which means API is built. And it certainly is kind of like a mini small, you know, mini launch pad can be mini Cloud Foundry and launch pad can be viewed and beyond that they can help some other kind of like application build on content box, for example, like there’s another use case called the centralized and decentralized player, it means that there used to be a very, very, very famous p2p player called called a KP. And the better this kind of like p2p player, it, it, it didn’t work because it cannot provide the protect as content creators. And this kind of like p2p is like, it’s a little bit like BitTorrent. So people, there’s no centralized service people can download, and the people, every single device can can be upload as small as a small CDN pack, note of the CDN. But the issue before that we caught Linda was no token, people can, people who only want to download that they do not want to upload and for download is also free. So that’s why a lot of copyright issues. So that’s why they want to improve the whole token economy inside this kind of like decentralized, decentralized player for every people if they download, they should cost the same token, if they upload the country builder, even they they are common creator there they are, they are the owner of the of the content, they can they can get a certain tokens. So and also in the in the chain of all in the chain of the common equation. For example, for the people who do the Translate, people who do the script can also share a portion, and then whole ecosystem it can be can run. So compared to the previous, the decentralized, no player, p2p player, this kind of like a token bass player, it can add more economy, incentivize the inside of the whole, the whole, the whole behaviors. So make, make sure that concrete or can pro provided people not only want to download, but they want to upload and an even for example, if you are fine, you don’t want to contribute, you only want to enjoy the content is still fine. Because you can purchase the same content, send tokens in the you know in the in the like a token token marketplace. And you can focus on what it’s like to play a game, you play our game, if you don’t want to spend the money, you how to do the contribution you how to play spending more time, but if you don’t spend more time but still want to have the best equipment in the game world, you have to pay some money. So it would be all like that, kind of like that. So this is some second scenario. The twist to use case I just mentioned only, you know, it’s only like a it’s only like us to have a lot of like, you know, the whole new decentralized content award. And you know, the, it will change the whole the whole way we are doing like today. So, so that’s why I think if this should happen, so there should be some kind of like content a blockchain has support Oh, they said this, like a scenario for example, the transition should be confirmed quickly, and all the transactions is in small amount is quite different from maybe from other you know, from other blockchains Media. So, better should it be a very small band a very high frequency. So try to increase, increase, the confirming increase of confirming efficiency, and trying to download the fee, and the try to make all the like, and also for content they need as a multi owner, try to make the mouth mouth e signatures and all very important. And also try to make the as a mention of both on the crowdfunding and on the crowdfunding mini pad and on the decentralized p2p player, they all need different kind of like kind of like different layers, that the money should be shared to different players. And so this is kind of like our methodology is quite different from some public some other public blockchain which is focusing on generic generic industry. So this is like why we try to build something really try to feed her the future, the future sees the future use case for decentralize the company industry. And to try to make the oldest oldest the oldest things happen with with very easy advisor kind of like a turnkey solution or API’s. And every single creators or every, like, small developers can be built on. Yeah, this is like the whole ideas of so come from the box. Brandon Zemp: Yeah, it’s awesome. Sounds like you got a ton of stuff going on and a ton of cool features coming out. So I asked the audience, if they had any questions you mind if I asked you if you Renee Wang: Do you have any questions? Brandon Zemp: I think Richard asked a few minutes ago, will iPhone users get an update where they can set people as admins? Renee Wang: Oh, yeah, I think that this feature will be launched in I think in two versions. So for Android to be already okay to set me and a block users. And four hours is like it already are in pipeline, I think it will be inside inside of the iPhone is in two weeks. Brandon Zemp: Very cool. Doug’s world said, was the idea for live cast to be more intimate, rather than just a podcast? Or just a radio show? Renee Wang: Yeah, yeah, of course, I think it’s an idea of life path is, is much bigger than only podcast and radio, because there’s an this my feeling of the future of the content consumption. Besides the whole decentralized world, as I mentioned, which can be you know, which content ball can contribute in the future, I think the future of your chain to matter, especially after 5g, because like after 5g, me all the devices, not only for all the devices can connect to the internet, all the all the calculation can be done in cloud. So if this is heightened, if this is a true, the whole, the whole world, like people connecting with information, or people connecting with people will, will change in totally. So it means that in the in the maybe in the near future, within two years, which frankly, is, you know, it’s more kind of like is it is dominant. So it means that all the devices can connect with the internet. And also, most of the devices that didn’t either have a screen. So it means that all the audio VOB involved the main, main way for people to access information and the people to connect with people. So that’s why I think a lot of pastor will also be build on on that part. So that would totally not not not related at all, to podcasts are not related to radio animal, this is a new way for people to kind of like how real time engagement, how real time, you know, engagement with people how real time content gathering with the most updated, most updated you know, worlds. So that wouldn’t be totally absent, that would be a little bit idea for live cast in the future as it will not happen within this year or next year. But within two years. So with, you know, after after two years, that would be you know, totally different for live cast, because it’s more social, it’s more entertainment, if there’s more engagement and adherence mode real time feedback. So, and also it will be based on older devices, as I mentioned without screen. So this is why we are doing a live cast. So and also beyond to that, I mean, even within this two years after the fact G is dominant, I think even within a similar cause, also changing the changing the way for creators. Previously, if only if you want to create a podcast or radio, you have to be a very, very professional, professional content creator, because it’s take a lot of time to create the content. But for the Lancaster, even UGC that user generated content can still share, share, share some attention of a certain part of the users, it means that, you know, for a live classroom didn’t need you know, 100 or 10,000 people maybe only three people if they want to chat with each other they can also still build a lab has the chat room, which is means that so it’s it means that if only if the top EDI interest that you can join so that would it be also different from the current podcast industrial The only, you know, professional or you know, semi professional creators can create good content. And only people want to listen to some to some like top top top pro high produced content because they if they are no there’s no engagement, the quality of the content is is crucial. So that’s like a so that’s would it be changing the whole work just like how YouTube or changing the you know, changing the DJ or changing the video shoot him what Brandon Zemp: Yeah, totally. Um, we’ll do one more question. Rolly Rolly, he asked what is live Cast Main competition. Renee Wang: So far livecast, they are not the only one. So we do not meet any direct competition. I mean, for Cosmos because there are too many podcaster will be how a lot of black that users have a lot of fighting for life has only been, we do have some like a video live streaming. You know, people love live streaming soon we are all which are all big giant like a like a Facebook Live, Instagram, lamb YouTube Live, and also for Twitch and caffeine. But for for me how used to be compared to all the kind of like livestreaming First, we are the only one who are very focused on audio. Second, we are the only a few bands only for ones that can supply a kind support is kind of like a call you just like now and talking with Brandon. So which is real time discussion. And also we are the only one that has almost no no less latency because for example, Facebook, or if you do a webcast take about a 32nd latency. But now we can tell you Tammy discussion, which means that, you know, it’s like last week, we just launched a trivia game, you know, in the last start by asking questions, and the user can get into get into answers, you know, VZ one seconds. So this is like even as I mentioned, there are some live streaming services. But a better compare but but mentioned about the features as I might and especially for virtual gift only twitch has that others and customers. So we have like so many unique feature which will offer focusing on audio, very focusing on this kind of like interactive, you know, conversation and this kind of like kind of like a gaming like what should give things. So that that means that has velocity is quite unique in discussing, so. But I believe this feature is good. I think there would be a lot of like competitors in the in the short term. So that’s why we try to move faster, try to be more innovative, and try to be more creative. Brandon Zemp: Absolutely. Well, Renee, thank you for coming on everything and testing out this live cast with me. And I think la cash is obviously going to be using it more in the future to help the audience interact and ask questions and everything. So yeah, definitely appreciate it. Thanks for coming on. Renee Wang: Thank you. Thank you. And I really appreciate it for giving this, this this piece or try. understand there are still some a lot of improvement, but maybe we’ll try to make our best to to make the feature as as good as possible. Brandon Zemp: Absolutely. It was awesome. The first time around and worked really well. Renee Wang: Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. And I appreciate all your time. Brandon Zemp: Of course. Thank you Renee. Have a great day. Renee Wang: Thank you Have a good day.